Author Topic: Why are you not participating  (Read 1270 times)

Administrator

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Re: Why are you not participating
« Reply #15 on: April 16, 2017, 09:53:55 AM »
>I think they are moving in the right direction.

I agree...some of them are on this forum and we didn't have that a year ago.

I might be wrong, but I think for low power laser machines, this is the main support forum for that segment of the industry.
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ThothLoki

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Re: Why are you not participating
« Reply #16 on: April 16, 2017, 10:25:46 AM »
George, they have to catch and convict me first.  ;D so Ralph has no reason to not allow me.  8)

Ralph, every google search leads me back to this site. This IS the tech support and much more. Heck, this site has started businesses, produced software and hardware both open and closed source.

This is the cutting edge site for our LPLs where anyone can learn from each other and potentially get some ideas from o use these for some income as well.
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Parnold

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Re: Why are you not participating
« Reply #17 on: April 17, 2017, 10:35:18 AM »
I would just like to take a moment to add my own personal thank you for this forum and all it's participants!  I got exactly the level of support that I expected from a Chinese toy, but found so much more than I anticipated here!

ThothLoki

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Re: Why are you not participating
« Reply #18 on: April 17, 2017, 10:37:15 AM »
I would just like to take a moment to add my own personal thank you for this forum and all it's participants!  I got exactly the level of support that I expected from a Chinese toy, but found so much more than I anticipated here!
AMEN!! SAME HERE.
Laser: A5 2000mw with L7 Board / A3 2500mw PWM with Mana SE -- All using T2Laser
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Stonemull

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Re: Why are you not participating
« Reply #19 on: April 17, 2017, 11:24:40 AM »
I am surprised anybody would actually expect support from china with a kit design, I would not even bother trying.
It is a lottery, if you are missing bits you may as well order some, it is not worth jumping through hoops trying to sort a free replacement, the profit margins on these are likely so low that they will make it difficult. The week before my laser arrived, I received a couple of drone kits, one has a half dead motor, the other is just a monster to build as a first kit. Luckily I was brought up in the 70's with meccano and electronics kits and like the challlenge of sorting things out. I got what I expected, if you want a fully functional, ready to go, perfectly performing device with a warranty, expect to pay 10 times more.
The way people are nowadays they also probably get many requests for faulty or missing parts that are completely fraudulent, along with dozens of people buying them that probably should not be trusted to cross the street by themselves, let alone flash firmware and tune hardware to perform properly.
If you want to be asked stupid questions, sell something technical. If you want to be ripped off, offer a no questions asked warranty.

Also adding a big thumbs up to the forum and its members, I like it here, you guys are skookum :)
You don't need to point people here, so many google searches I did on questions I had started with 'benbox.us' I gave in within an hour and registered.
I am still addicted to checking for new posts every hour or so lol.

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mrehmus

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Re: Why are you not participating
« Reply #20 on: April 17, 2017, 05:03:09 PM »
I am surprised anybody would actually expect support from china with a kit design, I would not even bother trying.
It is a lottery, if you are missing bits you may as well order some, it is not worth jumping through hoops trying to sort a free replacement, the profit margins on these are likely so low that they will make it difficult.

You may well be surprised but they are the ones who decided to sell this product at price points they set. They are not dummies and know full well that they should provide support. If they don't then their customer base is restricted to those who will either persevere or have the technical qualifications to correct problems.

I buy kits and expect the components to be operational. That is a reasonable expectation. It is also reasonable to expect a decent design, not something that is inherently dangerous (as are these 'kits' as they are delivered with the laser coming on if one doesn't understand the 'proper' power-on sequence). To compound the problem, we are at the end of a long supply chain and repair parts are difficult to come by. Especially when they change designs and don't document them in their sales literature. One can attempt to order a replacement board or component and after a three or four week delay, find out the part will not work. So your solution, to purchase replacement parts is itself a crap shoot.

Making excuses for the manufacturer just encourages them to continue with their (poor) business practices as usual. They will find that business as usual dies as they saturate the market of people who can and will fix their errors and omissions and most others won't play their game. We will then have what they call in the trade, Orphans.
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ThothLoki

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Re: Why are you not participating
« Reply #21 on: April 17, 2017, 07:21:51 PM »
Dude......It's CHINA

I understand you are frustrated, but this forum is meant to help each other and not just sit and bash on companies and their products. I am not trying to speak for others, but if you want to do that, go to reddit. Ralph started this forum for us to help each other. I came on last summer and have not looked back. From my time here, the intention of this forum is to create a community to help each other out and keep a positive attitude.

Personally, I have my issues with the design of these machines as does everyone else. BUT we take these negatives and turn them into an opportunity to make something new and special to share with each other. That being said,all of these flaws and complete disregard for safety have allowed me to be able to afford a laser engraver. I never expected support for the price of these machines. If I had wanted support, I would have shelled out the $5000+ for a name brand machine made in my country that comes with a service plan.

Remember, count your blessings.
Laser: A5 2000mw with L7 Board / A3 2500mw PWM with Mana SE -- All using T2Laser
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mrehmus

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Re: Why are you not participating
« Reply #22 on: April 17, 2017, 07:47:52 PM »
You will notice that I'm keeping my complaints to what I think is the proper location . . . here. If EleksMaker doesn't hear of better methods/reasons for supporting their customers, then where do they get their feedback? And what about those folks who buy and never find this forum or are incapable of fixing the problems. Or the poor person who hooks up the power and turns on the laser and gets an eyeful? That's a product that would get a U.S. manufacturer heavily fined. And don't forget, as I found out after my buy, that these products don't meet U.S. safety standards.

I appreciate this forum and I'll do my part to support it and the folks who provide it. but don't expect them to receive kudo's for the sloppy and dangerous engineering that has been documented in this forum.

The way to improve products and services is to let the folks who deliver them know when things are right and when they are wrong. Out of a thousand customers, one or two may give a company feedback. Astute companies value customer input positive or negative.

Nuff said.
mrehmus
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Stonemull

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Re: Why are you not participating
« Reply #23 on: April 17, 2017, 07:54:33 PM »
You are confusing a chinese seller who sells a collection of off the shelf parts at slightly more than cost as a 'manufacturer'.
You are not buying from them either, you are purchasing from a middleman (banggood, alexpress) who have a bunch of sellers who dropship the item to you and compete on the same forum for the lowest price.
I am not 'making excuses' for them, it is just the reality if the situation, in the time they take to answer your questions and box you up a nice replacement bit, label it and ship it out the door (throwing away any profits in the process and trusting you are not lieing about the fault) they could box up and send out a dozen more complete kits, Guess which option they choose.

Your comeback is the usual, you complain in the feedback section so others can read it, they either fix a problem area or sales dry up.

My laser fan never worked from new, I will mention it in feedback and pay a few dollars for a new fan, big deal.
If I expected a cast iron 24/7 warranty I would also expect the price be at least double what it is, I prefer the cheap option.

As for safety .. HAH. The supplied 'safety' goggles should be a hint, they probably think they are safe though and pat thenself on the back for doing the right thing.
I wonder what the US compliant version costs, with the laser rated safety perspex, cutoiff interlocks and key system.
Herex a hint, font look st the frigging thing while its operating. safe.


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ThothLoki

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Re: Why are you not participating
« Reply #24 on: April 17, 2017, 08:21:04 PM »
I wonder what the US compliant version costs, with the laser rated safety perspex, cutoiff interlocks and key system

The don't lol ones like what we have because of that fact. These thing have no safety. The closest would be something like an epilog  :D

When I build my box, I am going to install a key switch for the mains power as well as anothe one for the board power ( to replace the push button.) call it a double interlock if you want, but I have a 6 year old and want some additional safety margins. Right now it is she does not come out to the garage when I am burning even when I have a box over it. She pounds on the door and I go to her. I want better and plan for o make it so.
Laser: A5 2000mw with L7 Board / A3 2500mw PWM with Mana SE -- All using T2Laser
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nottingham82

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Re: Why are you not participating
« Reply #25 on: April 17, 2017, 09:32:38 PM »
You are confusing a chinese seller who sells a collection of off the shelf parts at slightly more than cost as a 'manufacturer'.
You are not buying from them either, you are purchasing from a middleman (banggood, alexpress) who have a bunch of sellers who dropship the item to you and compete on the same forum for the lowest price.
I am not 'making excuses' for them, it is just the reality if the situation, in the time they take to answer your questions and box you up a nice replacement bit, label it and ship it out the door (throwing away any profits in the process and trusting you are not lieing about the fault) they could box up and send out a dozen more complete kits, Guess which option they choose.

Your comeback is the usual, you complain in the feedback section so others can read it, they either fix a problem area or sales dry up.

My laser fan never worked from new, I will mention it in feedback and pay a few dollars for a new fan, big deal.
If I expected a cast iron 24/7 warranty I would also expect the price be at least double what it is, I prefer the cheap option.

As for safety .. HAH. The supplied 'safety' goggles should be a hint, they probably think they are safe though and pat thenself on the back for doing the right thing.
I wonder what the US compliant version costs, with the laser rated safety perspex, cutoiff interlocks and key system.
Herex a hint, font look st the frigging thing while its operating. safe.


To be fair eleksmaker isnt a manufacturer either.  Elekmaker is a designer, some hard working 4 year old Chinese child is the manufacturer, and bangood is the distributor.

or

Elekmaker is a designer, some hard working 4 year old Chinese child is the manufacturer, alliexpress is the website, and a 5 year old Chinese businessman is the distributor.

Hard working youngsters in that part of the world.  I didnt even have a paper route.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2017, 09:36:54 PM by nottingham82 »
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Stonemull

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Re: Why are you not participating
« Reply #26 on: April 17, 2017, 09:43:32 PM »
I think you misread what I posted, WE are the manufacturer, they assemble a box of parts.

I even had a paper route, then I moved up in the world and collected paper money after I got the sack from throwing them on rooves and under cars and sprinklers.

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nottingham82

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Re: Why are you not participating
« Reply #27 on: April 17, 2017, 09:57:47 PM »
haha well someone had to "manufacture" the parts we manufacture our lasers out of. 

Your sorted job history makes things so much clearer!
Laser: 2500mw A5 eleks maker
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Stonemull

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Re: Why are you not participating
« Reply #28 on: April 18, 2017, 12:42:16 AM »
The lasers are also assembled from parts sourced elsewhere, a laser diode, a chopped up heatsink extrusion, a lens from another supplier and a driver board probably etched in one facility and loaded by robot in yet another.
Go visit the laser diode manufacturer and they probably receive silicon dies from a fab house elsewhere and case them up with a simple lens also made elsewhere by the million.
I imagine they get a 5 second go-nogo test after assembly that does not go as far as seeing if the fan rotates.

Its turtles all the way down.
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ThothLoki

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Re: Why are you not participating
« Reply #29 on: April 18, 2017, 05:03:22 AM »
I just listened to a podcast yesterday about a guy who was in China and walked the streets to source parts to make his own iPhone. Apparently they have more places to buy chips and whatnot (probably stuff that did not make the quality control) than we have McDonald's and White Castle combined. He was able to get all of the parts, even the right main chip to run iOS. He made the equivalent of a iphone6 for about $175usd
Laser: A5 2000mw with L7 Board / A3 2500mw PWM with Mana SE -- All using T2Laser
3D Printer: Monoprice Maker Select v2.1
Image Resizer Applications (All OS): http://benboxlaser.us/index.php/topic,1434.msg17297.html#msg17297